How to test Potentiometric Rotary Angle Transducers ?

munzir · Oct 30, 2011

How to test Inductive Rotary Angle Transducers & Potentiometric Rotary Angle Transducers ?

testing circuits are required

thanks

kak111 · Oct 30, 2011

Mentioned transducers have several different implementations depending of the model or type.
they may have a built-in electronics.
So more exact info is needed for testing................

Potentiometric Transducers principle is potentiometer.
Inductive Rotary Angle Transducer can be RVDT (Rotary Variable Differential Transformer) , for test see : how to test LVDT

munzir · Oct 31, 2011

kak111 said:
Mentioned transducers have several different implementations depending of the model or type.
they may have a built-in electronics.
So more exact info is needed for testing................

Potentiometric Transducers principle is potentiometer.
Inductive Rotary Angle Transducer can be RVDT (Rotary Variable Differential Transformer) , for test see : how to test LVDT

kindly, provide the testing circuit for this : Potentiometric Transducer Series CLP13

thanks

kak111 · Oct 31, 2011

This is one way to test this type potentiometric transducers.
(Linear potentiometric transducer)

CLP13 - Potentiometric Linear Transducer_testCirc.jpg

**broken link removed**

**broken link removed**

danishdeshmuk · Nov 1, 2011

kak111 said:
Mentioned transducers have several different implementations depending of the model or type.
they may have a built-in electronics.
So more exact info is needed for testing................

Potentiometric Transducers principle is potentiometer.
Inductive Rotary Angle Transducer can be RVDT (Rotary Variable Differential Transformer) , for test see : how to test LVDT

thanks very much

Are Inductive Rotary Angle Transducers & RVDT (Rotary Variable Differential Transformer) same things ?

For testing Inductive Rotary Angle Transducer OR RVDT (Rotary Variable Differential Transformer) , should i follow the same procedure & same testing circuit as of LVDT ?

kak111 · Nov 1, 2011

Are Inductive Rotary Angle Transducers & RVDT (Rotary Variable Differential Transformer) same things ?

No. ( RVDT is one member of Inductive Rotary Angle Transducer Family.)
Inductive Rotary Angle Transducer is general name for all Rotary Angle Transducers with Inductive sensing principle.
RVDT is Inductive Rotary Angle Transducer but specifically because its sensing principle is Differential Transformer
it is called Rotary Variable Differential Transformer .

For ex. other named Inductive Rotary Angle Transducers are PIPS®-based displacement transducers. (RIPS , LIPS)
Look this................
PIPS: A New Technology in Inductive Position Sensing
https://www.evrtp.com/everight_positek/pdf/Custom_Positek_Technology_Paper.pdf

For testing Inductive Rotary Angle Transducer OR RVDT (Rotary Variable Differential Transformer) , should i follow the same procedure & same testing circuit as of LVDT ?

RVDT (Rotary Variable Differential Transformer) and LVDT (Linear Variable Differential Transformer) have same procedure & same testing circuit.

danishdeshmuk · Nov 2, 2011

would you show me how to test RVDT by taking any example , so i could comprehend the idea for testing them ?

thanks

munzir · Nov 2, 2011

kak111 said:
No. ( RVDT is one member of Inductive Rotary Angle Transducer Family.)
Inductive Rotary Angle Transducer is general name for all Rotary Angle Transducers with Inductive sensing principle.
RVDT is Inductive Rotary Angle Transducer but specifically because its sensing principle is Differential Transformer
it is called Rotary Variable Differential Transformer .

For ex. other named Inductive Rotary Angle Transducers are PIPS®-based displacement transducers. (RIPS , LIPS)
Look this................
PIPS: A New Technology in Inductive Position Sensing
https://www.evrtp.com/everight_positek/pdf/Custom_Positek_Technology_Paper.pdf

RVDT (Rotary Variable Differential Transformer) and LVDT (Linear Variable Differential Transformer) have same procedure & same testing circuit.

thanks KAK111 ;

kindly, would you want to tell that how do the engineers decide what to use RVDT or Inductive Rotary Angle Transducer ?

thanxXx

kak111 · Nov 2, 2011

would you show me how to test RVDT by taking any example , so i could comprehend the idea for testing them ?

RVDT and LVDT have same working principle & same testing circuit.

Instruction is here .............
https://www.edaboard.com/threads/228939/#post977298

tell that how do the engineers decide what to use RVDT or Inductive Rotary Angle Transducer ?

There are many criteria for the selection, some are...
- suitability of operating principle
- required accuracy
- requirements of the mechanical structure
- requirements of control device

danishdeshmuk · Nov 3, 2011

kak111 said:
RVDT and LVDT have same working principle & same testing circuit.

View attachment 63734
Instruction is here .............
https://www.edaboard.com/threads/228939/#post977298

There are many criteria for the selection, some are...
- suitability of operating principle
- required accuracy
- requirements of the mechanical structure
- requirements of control device

what should be the applied AC supply & of what frequency ?

Should the output be varied with the varied AC supply voltage ?

thanks a lot KAK111

kak111 · Nov 3, 2011

what should be the applied AC supply & of what frequency ?

Supply voltage and frequency can vary between different RVDT types.
Usually (50....15000Hz )

For test supply you can use for example 5Vac 50Hz with 100 ohm 1/4W series resistor ,
connected for protect primary against overcurrent.

Allways first thing to do before testing , find out electrical data and connections.

Coils can simply check with ohm-meter. ( only for check , are the coils damaged )

Some RVDT types have secondary midpoint output connection ( 3 secondary pins )
or both secondary separate outputs ( 4 secondary pins )
Normal differential transformer connection shown in attached picture.

During test primary ac voltage must have a constant value, change only rotor angle.

additional info...........
eFunda: Introduction to Rotational Variable Differential Transformer (RVDT)

How it Works - LVDT

Should the output be varied with the varied AC supply voltage ?

Like in normal transformers , when primary voltage change then secondary voltage change too.

phatcreators · Nov 4, 2011

kak111 said:
Supply voltage and frequency can vary between different RVDT types.
Usually (50....15000Hz )

For test supply you can use for example 5Vac 50Hz with 100 ohm 1/4W series resistor ,
connected for protect primary against overcurrent.

Allways first thing to do before testing , find out electrical data and connections.

Coils can simply check with ohm-meter. ( only for check , are the coils damaged )

Some RVDT types have secondary midpoint output connection ( 3 secondary pins )
or both secondary separate outputs ( 4 secondary pins )
Normal differential transformer connection shown in attached picture.

During test primary ac voltage must have a constant value, change only rotor angle.

additional info...........
eFunda: Introduction to Rotational Variable Differential Transformer (RVDT)

How it Works - LVDT

Like in normal transformers , when primary voltage change then secondary voltage change too.

would you take any example of 3 secondary pins configuration (secondary midpoint output connection) ?

would you take any example of 4 secondary pins configuration (separate outputs) ?

thanks

kak111 · Nov 4, 2011

would you take any example of 3 secondary pins configuration (secondary midpoint output connection) ?
would you take any example of 4 secondary pins configuration (separate outputs) ?

When operating in Differential mode, the center tap of the output windings is often not used.

When we want to get much higher accuracy from our LVDT sensor (at least one order of magnitude)
we must use a LVDT sensor which is suitable for Ratiometric operation and a Ratiometric signal conditioning.

Electronics and wiring for ratiometric LVDT & RVDT : Used with 3 and 4 wire sensors
Look Circuits Examples For Use With LVDTs here
**broken link removed**

Compensating the Input to Output phase shift that naturally occurs in LVDTs.
Synchronous vs. Asynchronous Demodulation : Used with 3 and 4 wire sensors

Circuit principles...........
**broken link removed**

danishdeshmuk · Nov 5, 2011

kak111 said:
When operating in Differential mode, the center tap of the output windings is often not used.

When we want to get much higher accuracy from our LVDT sensor (at least one order of magnitude)
we must use a LVDT sensor which is suitable for Ratiometric operation and a Ratiometric signal conditioning.

Electronics and wiring for ratiometric LVDT & RVDT : Used with 3 and 4 wire sensors
Look Circuits Examples For Use With LVDTs here
**broken link removed**

Compensating the Input to Output phase shift that naturally occurs in LVDTs.
Synchronous vs. Asynchronous Demodulation : Used with 3 and 4 wire sensors

Circuit principles...........
**broken link removed**

How to test the above mentioned 2 configurations : secondary pins configuration (secondary midpoint output connection) & 4 secondary pins configuration (separate outputs) ?

kak111 · Nov 5, 2011

You can test LVDT or RVDT transducer / sensor with 3/4 wire like in this principle picture.......

Measured signals you see here...........
How it Works - LVDT

I gave you allready schematics
**broken link removed**
**broken link removed**

generally for testing any known system and device connections
we must to know the exact types of components and all data for them.
Plus of course all system schematics and parameters...etc...etc..

I would assume that the LVDT & RVDT testing is now
well-known thing for you...........
and suggest that LVDT & RVDT testing has now been studied for everybody and solved.

Once more : Allways first thing to do before testing , find out all electrical data , connections
and working principles for the whole system , you are testing

danishdeshmuk · Nov 5, 2011

kak111 said:
You can test LVDT or RVDT transducer / sensor with 3/4 wire like in this principle picture.......
View attachment 63866

Measured signals you see here...........
How it Works - LVDT

I gave you allready schematics
**broken link removed**
**broken link removed**

generally for testing any known system and device connections
we must to know the exact types of components and all data for them.
Plus of course all system schematics and parameters...etc...etc..

I would assume that the LVDT & RVDT testing is now
well-known thing for you...........
and suggest that LVDT & RVDT testing has now been studied for everybody and solved.

bundle of thanks to you

connect channel A of the oscilloscope to the Primary ???

& connect channel B of the oscilloscope to the sec1 ????

Am i right ?

OR

connect channel A of the oscilloscope to the Primary ???

& connect channel B of the oscilloscope to the sec1 ????

& then connect channel B of the oscilloscope to the sec2 & keep channel A to the Primary ????

Am i right ?

kak111 · Nov 6, 2011

connect channel A of the oscilloscope to the Primary ???
& connect channel B of the oscilloscope to the sec1 ????

This is for checking secondary 1.

then connect channel B of the oscilloscope to the sec2 & keep channel A to the Primary ????

This is for checking secondary 2.

Checking differential signal.
connect the secondary windings in series , use opposite directions. (Thisway you get signal secondary 1 minus secondary 2.)

At the centre of the position measurement stroke, the two secondary voltages of the displacement transducer are
equal but because they are connected in opposition the resulting output from the sensor is zero.
Look picture........
How it Works - LVDT

danishdeshmuk · Nov 7, 2011

thanks a lot KAK111,

KAK ... would you please differentiate between transducer & sensor ? (all guys are welcome to answer this but specially KAK)

thanks

FvM · Nov 7, 2011

In my opinion, the answer has been given completely in this previous thread https://www.edaboard.com/threads/229162/

You'll notice, that there are some different viewpoints left. I doubt however, that it will give much new insights to continue the discussion.

Referring to present problem, potentiometers can be considered both, sensors and transducers. I personally prefer the term sensor for devices with an electrical output signal, that is exclusively powered from an external power supply.

phatcreators · Nov 7, 2011

FvM i think you should differentiate the two terms with your own personal experience & knowledge not by means of wikipedia .....

thanks though

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